Jusunlee.com Forums Pages (2): [1] 2 »
Show all 25 posts from this thread on one page

Jusunlee.com Forums (https://www.jusunlee.com/forums/index.php)
- Debate (https://www.jusunlee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=19)
-- evolution or revelation? (https://www.jusunlee.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=12280)

Posted by phil c on 05-19-2003 04:50 PM:

evolution or revelation?

since forever has the struggle btw evolution and religion been fought...evidence here and evidence there "prove" that both are true...personally i believe in my own religion (Christianity) and the Bible...people of religious faith may be biased...it doesnt matter what other people believe about the coming of the world and our race...and as morpheus sayz in the matrix: reloaded...my beliefs do not require them (others) to...people of religious faith...shouldn need other people to choose their beliefs...

another thought....archaeology found in the Bible is also found on Earth proving that the Bible and the people and places in the Bible actually once did exist....the theory of evolution contradicts the beliefs of most religions...

on the other hand...evolution does prove many other things to be somewhat true...the big bang seems kinda "out there"...and everything evolving from a prokaryote bacteria is uhm...a big chunk of time...

evolution to me is dead...doesnt matter what they teach us in school...because they should be incorporating religious lessons in schools like they used to...ya wonder why they took those ideas out of schools huh..i wonder....

__________________
phil c

Posted by kryogenix on 05-19-2003 07:37 PM:

Re: evolution or revelation?

quote:
Originally posted by phil c
since forever has the struggle btw evolution and religion been fought...evidence here and evidence there "prove" that both are true...personally i believe in my own religion (Christianity) and the Bible...people of religious faith may be biased...it doesnt matter what other people believe about the coming of the world and our race...and as morpheus sayz in the matrix: reloaded...my beliefs do not require them (others) to...people of religious faith...shouldn need other people to choose their beliefs...

another thought....archaeology found in the Bible is also found on Earth proving that the Bible and the people and places in the Bible actually once did exist....the theory of evolution contradicts the beliefs of most religions...

on the other hand...evolution does prove many other things to be somewhat true...the big bang seems kinda "out there"...and everything evolving from a prokaryote bacteria is uhm...a big chunk of time...

evolution to me is dead...doesnt matter what they teach us in school...because they should be incorporating religious lessons in schools like they used to...ya wonder why they took those ideas out of schools huh..i wonder....

i'm catholic, so i believe in creationism. but i think you should be a little more open minded.

Posted by phil c on 05-19-2003 07:48 PM:

Re: Re: evolution or revelation?

quote:
Originally posted by kryogenix
i'm catholic, so i believe in creationism. but i think you should be a little more open minded.


ive tried..but thx

__________________
phil c

Posted by Alchemist on 05-19-2003 09:03 PM:

Evolution wouldn’t necessarily have to contradict religious beliefs.
I personally do not believe that evolution contradicts creationism.
Also God did not write the Bible, humans did. How can you be sure that it is 100% accurate/literal?

Posted by phil c on 05-19-2003 09:50 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Alchemist
Evolution wouldn’t necessarily have to contradict religious beliefs.
I personally do not believe that evolution contradicts creationism.
Also God did not write the Bible, humans did. How can you be sure that it is 100% accurate/literal?


tru alchemist..but the humans who did write it had a direct link with Jesus..who is also known as God...and since the humans had a direct link with Jesus..they also had a direct link with God

__________________
phil c

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 05-19-2003 10:18 PM:

Re: evolution or revelation?

quote:
Originally posted by phil c

evolution to me is dead...doesnt matter what they teach us in school...because they should be incorporating religious lessons in schools like they used to...ya wonder why they took those ideas out of schools huh..i wonder....


i think it's not in schools becuase there simply isn't a place for it to be categorized in. Sure, if you take a relligion class, then there's a place to teach it. But, it's by no means classified under science, no science is in there. It's a science class, not a "let's connect religion and science" class. Evolution is taught becuase it's a scientific methodology with some sort of substantiation. The same reason that string theory and the like are taught.

Furthermore, religion is too vast to be taught which is why it's not taught usually unless you take a specific class. And, then there's that whole separation of church and state, yah? No, evolution is not a religion that's why it's not banned in schools. Think about it, it makes sense. We don't need a belief argument here, we know we don't know anything is true, but i find it hard to believe that science and religion are the same thing just becuase htey share an element of "faith" in them. i.e. no following is existent either that demand htings of its disciples, etc.

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 05-19-2003 10:23 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by phil c
tru alchemist..but the humans who did write it had a direct link with Jesus..who is also known as God...and since the humans had a direct link with Jesus..they also had a direct link with God


multiplying errors

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by merdawg on 05-19-2003 10:53 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by PsychoSnowman
multiplying errors


can u explain to me how they are errors?

__________________


"Love is like a friendship caught on fire. In the beginning a flame, very pretty, often hot and fierce, but still only light and flickering. As love grows older, our hearts mature and our love becomes as coals, deep-burning and unquenchable. " - Bruce Lee

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 05-19-2003 11:37 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by merdawg
can u explain to me how they are errors?


well i was speaking through my perspective so naturally i think they are errors seeing as how i don't believe in creationism. Perhaps it is better if i had said this:

multiplying uncertainties.

the point was just to show that i don't think that talk about how we are linked through a link through a link validates anything, it just compounds any error there could be. Makes it that much more uncertain.

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by merdawg on 05-20-2003 01:12 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by PsychoSnowman
well i was speaking through my perspective so naturally i think they are errors seeing as how i don't believe in creationism. Perhaps it is better if i had said this:

multiplying uncertainties.

the point was just to show that i don't think that talk about how we are linked through a link through a link validates anything, it just compounds any error there could be. Makes it that much more uncertain.


oh ok, i wasn't clear on ur point. thnx for explaining

__________________


"Love is like a friendship caught on fire. In the beginning a flame, very pretty, often hot and fierce, but still only light and flickering. As love grows older, our hearts mature and our love becomes as coals, deep-burning and unquenchable. " - Bruce Lee

Posted by rawr itz errinn on 05-20-2003 02:28 PM:

nothing really relevant to this topic... but i thought i might say this. a group of scientists found a fossil of this one fish that they had never identified before. they did their little carbon dating thing and said it was a few million years old (or was it a few billion, i can't keep up with huge numbers)and claimed it to be extinct. anyhow, a short time later, they found the species of fish... that was living.

also another thing, the Bible talks about the Pleiades (spelling?)... The Pleiades are a constellation that consists of 7 (i think) stars. In the bible, it says that they were clusters and several starts made up "each one". meaning, from earth, we wouldn't be able to see the several tiny stars. each of those little stars were so close together that, from the naked eye, they looked like one star. and mind you... the Bible was written WAY before galileo and his invention of the telescope.

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 05-20-2003 08:38 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by rawr itz errinn
nothing really relevant to this topic... but i thought i might say this. a group of scientists found a fossil of this one fish that they had never identified before. they did their little carbon dating thing and said it was a few million years old (or was it a few billion, i can't keep up with huge numbers)and claimed it to be extinct. anyhow, a short time later, they found the species of fish... that was living.


this happens all the time. I'm not sure what point you meant to make with this, and from your "irrelevence to the topic" bit i have no idea what you mean. But, this happens more often than you think. What does it prove? The lumpy shark was once thought to have been extinct becuase they had never seen one living before, and hoho, they found them living off the coast of new zealand. I don't see what this shows. I mean...so what? Whether or not something is extinct isn't contingent upon evolutionary fact or evidence...this is how things are deemed extinct...They cna't find them in living in the present time. Please tell me what you hope to accomplish through poniting this out. This is as connected with evolution as evolution is to religion.


quote:

also another thing, the Bible talks about the Pleiades (spelling?)... The Pleiades are a constellation that consists of 7 (i think) stars. In the bible, it says that they were clusters and several starts made up "each one". meaning, from earth, we wouldn't be able to see the several tiny stars. each of those little stars were so close together that, from the naked eye, they looked like one star. and mind you... the Bible was written WAY before galileo and his invention of the telescope.


good for them. They figured it out...what does this prove? Am i supposed to discredit them to any sort of higher level thinking and believe there is no way they could have figured that out without divine revelation? Humans can figure out it's not just one star, it's not a radical idea and we did figure it out...wow. This seems so loosely connected to religion. It's just mentioned in the bible....so what.

Furthermore, i just took the IB HL physics test, and may i simply throw this out there: Rayleigh's Criterion.

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by Street RSX on 05-20-2003 10:47 PM:

i support creationism, because i am a christian.
but evolution does have points.
the whole debate about the universe again.. with the big bang theory.. (the universe tread in this same forum)
you can put it together and say that God created the Universe. since he did create everything. its hard to say everything began from nothingness. nothingness cant just explode.. can it? I think this is the best way to prove Creationism over evolution.

Order - God provides the best explanation for abstract notions, such as numbers, formulas and properties.
Causation - God provides the best explanation for the existence of the universe and all that is in it.
Design - God provides the best explanation for the complex order in cosmological and biological entities.
Morality - God provides the best explanation for the existence of objective moral/ethical values in the world.

God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent.

and for the bible, it gives guidance in our journey through life to eternity, as well as leads us to a relationship with the God of the universe. it's a historical book that is backed by archeology and a prophetic book that has lived up to all of its claims so far. written by 40 writers, split into 66 books, and has a span of over 1500 years. and in 2 Timothy 3:16 states that “All scripture is inspired by God….” In 2 Peter 1:20-21, Peter reminds the reader to “know this first of all, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, … but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.” The Bible itself tells us that it is God who is the author of His book.

Posted by phil c on 05-21-2003 12:24 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Street RSX
i support creationism, because i am a christian.
but evolution does have points.
the whole debate about the universe again.. with the big bang theory.. (the universe tread in this same forum)
you can put it together and say that God created the Universe. since he did create everything. its hard to say everything began from nothingness. nothingness cant just explode.. can it? I think this is the best way to prove Creationism over evolution.

Order - God provides the best explanation for abstract notions, such as numbers, formulas and properties.
Causation - God provides the best explanation for the existence of the universe and all that is in it.
Design - God provides the best explanation for the complex order in cosmological and biological entities.
Morality - God provides the best explanation for the existence of objective moral/ethical values in the world.

God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent.

and for the bible, it gives guidance in our journey through life to eternity, as well as leads us to a relationship with the God of the universe. it's a historical book that is backed by archeology and a prophetic book that has lived up to all of its claims so far. written by 40 writers, split into 66 books, and has a span of over 1500 years. and in 2 Timothy 3:16 states that “All scripture is inspired by God….” In 2 Peter 1:20-21, Peter reminds the reader to “know this first of all, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, … but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.” The Bible itself tells us that it is God who is the author of His book.


agred...u dont hafta change ur ideals snow...im juss statin my beliefs...no one said u hafta convert...

__________________
phil c

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 05-21-2003 04:20 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by phil c
agred...u dont hafta change ur ideals snow...im juss statin my beliefs...no one said u hafta convert...


i know...

i just want you to answer what i am saying. There isn't any coercion going either direction. I don't know why you played that card, it's nonexistent in this thread. No conversion needs to be done in order for you to just answer what i say...

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by phil c on 05-21-2003 09:45 PM:

whatz ur question snow?

__________________
phil c

Posted by phil c on 05-21-2003 09:49 PM:

oh and if you want some verification on the archaeology...check this out...

http://www.jusunlee.com/forums/show...;threadid=12011

__________________
phil c

Posted by requiem on 05-22-2003 03:22 AM:

As .aS said in that post you just linked - do you really think that's an unbiased website?
If someone, anyone, spent the time posting links to all the evidence of evolution, or things that the BIble does not really jive with, would you change your mind?
Embrace the futility.

__________________
When the day is done
you are all that is left

Posted by phil c on 05-22-2003 03:47 AM:

im not tryin to change anyones mind..im juss backing up what i believe in...as snow said before...no need for conversion here...

__________________
phil c

Posted by kryogenix on 05-23-2003 07:49 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by phil c
im not tryin to change anyones mind..im juss backing up what i believe in...as snow said before...no need for conversion here...

yes, people get real touchy when they argue about the issue between creationism and evolutionism

All times are GMT. The time now is 06:49 PM. Pages (2): [1] 2 »
Show all 25 posts from this thread on one page